Leading the Emergence

Sensemaking in a Time of Emergence

• Kate Ebner • Season 1 • Episode 3

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How do we make sense of what the world look like after the pandemic?  Join Host Kate Ebner and MIT professor Deborah Ancona for a fascinating conversation about how to think about and structure the unknown so that we can act in it. Uncertain times require new leadership capabilities, including the ability to make sense of an ever-changing context. Dr. Ancona shares three practical strategies for learning how to use sensemaking to gain confidence and direction in the pandemic era. 

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Narrator:

The Nebo Company presents Leading the Emergence with your host, Kate Ebner.

Kate Ebner:

Good afternoon. I'm Kate Ebner. My guest today is Deborah Ancona. She is here to talk with us about sense-making and I have to tell you it's my great pleasure to have her as a guest today. Deborah is the Seley Distinguished Professor of Management, Professor of Organizational Studies and founder of the MIT Leadership Center at the MIT Sloan School of Management. She has done pioneering research into how successful teams operate and i t's highlighted the critical importance of managing outside as well as inside the t eam's boundary. Her work has also looked at concepts like distributed leadership and the development of teaching coaching models that enable people to foster creative leadership on every level. in my work, we frequently referenced an article that De borah c ontributed to ca lled i n praise of the incomplete leader. This is available to the Harvard business review, and as I've been studying this question of emergence and how do we understand what an emergence is and what is emerging from this post pandemic or this pandemic into post pandemic period. I find myself turning again and again, Deborah to your work, to your ideas and in particular to your forecasts model out of that fo ur c a ps m odel, we're go nna a ctually focus today on the topic of sense-making. So I wa nted t o begin by just welcoming you and saying, thank you for joining me.

Dr. Deborah Ancona:

Well, it's lovely to be here. So thanks for the invitation. And, I'm glad that the work has been useful.

Kate Ebner:

It really has. And I will just start by saying that, you know, sense-making, to me is very consistent with work that we've done at the Institute for transformational leadership, really thinking about how people make meaning of the world that they live in, how as human beings, we are meaning making machines, so to speak, you know, no sooner does something happen to us. Then we begin to describe it and think about what it is that's just happened and what it means. And so what I'd like to begin with is just actually inviting you Deborah to share your definition of sense-making.

Dr. Deborah Ancona:

Sure. Um, so I want to give credit where credit is due sense-making, has been brought into the organizational arena by Carl W yke. Carl was a professor at the university of Michigan and he's written numerous books on the topic of s ense-making. U m, we use it in a slightly different way, just referring to how you make sense of the context in which you are operating. So it's asking the question really what's going on out there because particularly now when, the speed at which change is happening, it was accelerating before COVID, but now it's really on steroids. And so you constantly have to make sense of your context, because what you saw a month ago a week ago is not the same thing that you see today. So really it is understanding what's going on across your, across your boundaries in that external world, or even within your boundaries as well. Things are changing within organizational boundaries as well. So making sense of that context and we, we typically think of several different aspects of sense-making. one is to be open to the external environment and what has changed, because it's very easy to get locked in what you think the environment looks like to get locked into. Okay, these are my competitors, or this is the latest technology and not being open to the fact that that model might be outdated. A second aspect of se nse-making i s collecting a lot of data. So if you want to know what's going on out there, you have to get out and learn from others and observe interview, d o focus groups whatever's necessary to learn about your environment. you need to then pull it all together, just going out and collecting more information does not get you far, unless you can consolidate it, say, what are the patterns? What are the trends? What does it look like? Carl White tal ks about sense-making as map- making, th a t the leader is a cartographer that has to pull together all these disparate pieces of data into something that makes sense, a map that others can read and finally experimenting to update and improve the model over time. So that's a rather long-winded answer to the question of what is sense-making.

Kate Ebner:

That's a great answer. And, you know, so many thoughts came to my mind as I was listening to you. I think we'll dig into this in, in several different ways, but I mean, one of the things that you said is that we constantly have to make sense of our context and that the COVID pandemic has meant that our context was, you know, accelerated the momentum of change. It also brought new context practically month by month. And so I think for many leaders in organizations, the need to not only make sense, you know, once, but to continuously keep checking in and triangulating new information, assessing, you know, the environment and then figuring out, okay, where are we now? What does it mean? And how does that shape and influence the choices and decisions available to us? You know, what direction are we heading? It's been a very, very intense for people, as you know, and I'm, I'm interested in starting with a question that's kind of a big question, but during a time of uncertainty, and that's the phrase that people have used brought on by the pandemic, many storylines have emerged about the future. And I'm curious, as you've been tracking with this rapidly changing context, what are the storylines that you've been noticing or following?

Dr. Deborah Ancona:

Um, so that's an interesting question. And I think in some ways, what we've been following to date is actually not as interesting as the pivot that people are making now, which is what is going to be happening after we started come out of the pandemic. And so I think they're the key key trend I think is, is saying that it's not going to be the same as it was before, but it's not going to be totally different either. So what does that mean? Um, because there've been so many changes in so many domains, whether it's telemedicine or education being online, as well as hybrid, whether it's work with people working from home and working i n, in different ways or travel, are we go ing t o g o back to traveling or how is it going to be different banking. I did some work with the world development bank and, w h at they have to do with their customers is completely different because the needs are very different. And so all of a sudden they find themselves creating, for example, public private partnerships where none existed before research is very different, R and D organizations in pharma, or have been working in very different ways. You have big competitors whether it's Me rck w orking with Pfizer or, t o Ca t o wo rking, w i th Novartis, all of a sudden competitors are working together and they're collaborating not only with themselves, but with the government, with regulators, with universities, they're trying things out more rapidly trying to do more in, in tandem. So I think, I think the big question across those various and sundry areas is how are we going to come out of this? What's going to be left and what do we go back to? So that's the narrative I'm kind of looking at. So if going forward more and more people are still working from home, how do you also deal with issues at the team level, for example, of identity of belonging, of socializing, new members of coordinating, it' s going to be some hybrid, perhaps people work from home, but they come in on particular days or at particular moments when new people are coming in or when there's a need for learning across the organization or just for identity or community building. Um, so I think that the key question now is, is what is the meshing of this new world we come to exist in and the old world? What is that going to look like across these various domains?

Kate Ebner:

Yeah, that's a really great and clarifying question actually for us to, to take in. And, you know, I think, you know, in the early days of, of the pandemic, people would say that we can get back to normal. We can get back to usual. And I think this idea of, yeah, you know, some things will return. Other things will be different. Um, some new things maybe present there's a meshing going on and, you know, change, as we know, changes is inevitable. Change is always happening. I think we've seen this acceleration and we've also seen these new forces come into play. Um, I'm curious about the comment you made earlier about, Carl, l ike h is work where h e's, you said that he would describe, you know, the concept of leader as c artographer sort of making maps. I'm curious about how to make a map when there's so much change happening.

Dr. Deborah Ancona:

Oh, that's a good question. How do you make a map when so much is, is is changing? And so I think you make a map through a variety of ways. Um, first of all, I think from a leadership standpoint first thing you need to do to make a map is get a lot of people sense-making, because you can't make a map unless you have the data to do so. So leaders then need to signal that it's important say, okay, this is something we're g oing t o do a nd, and show people the value of that. U m, Hey, the, the industry has changed if we don't keep up now, we're go ing t o f all behind, s o signal that it's important and begin to model it, begin to do it. Um, so for example I was lucky enough to, to get invited to a dinner with, a CEO who was interested in, in shifting models of leadership. And what was really interesting is that before we got to the dinner where we were in to discuss sense-making and other capabilities, he had a cocktail hour and in that cocktail hour, he had his senior team not wandering around with their cocktails, just chatting away, but rather in a circle right around not around him, but he was part of the circle. And he would basically start off by saying, okay, so-and-so, what's going on in your part of the business? What keeps you up at night? What are the challenges, what are you nervous about? What are you excited about, and getting each of the people around that circle to report in, so that at the end of the cocktail hour, everybody had a better sense of what was going on. There was collective sense-making about what was going on. So modeling and getting, getting people involved and enthusiastic and showing as you collect data, then you send that practice out to others. Um, w e t h ink, sorry, go ahead.

Kate Ebner:

Well, I was just going to say, I think that's a really great example because you know, that even though that might look and feel somewhat like the sort of classic update conversation, people updating each other, they, the additional effort to make sense together of what we're experiencing. Um, so the, yes, there's this giddy informed part, but there's also a kind of a processing together is what I'm hearing.

Dr. Deborah Ancona:

Yeah. And, you know, you can also make it a practice in your organization, not just to go out. So ask people, go out, go out and observe things, go out and interview people, go out and do focus groups so that you bring in data about what your competitors are doing about what your customers want about how the market is changing about what technologies are being used, where you want to give people permission to go out, but also to come back and engage in that. So what did we learn? So what does it mean, to collectively come together and create models of the world? And it could be a picture it could be, here are the five trends that we see something that pulls that, that all together. U m, but that i t is a collective process. And it's one that you encourage not just you and your top team to do, but people throughout the organization pre COVID. I, I always, I always like to tell a story of my daughter who was working at li and Fung and, part, as a, as an intern, as a summer in terim. So the lowest person on the totem pole and when the senior leadership wanted trends in, in fashion what did they do? They sent these interns from different parts of the world, Milan and Paris in N ew York, t o go out into the city, take pictures with their camera of boutiques and cool department stores. And then those interns had to co me back full together and say, what did we learn? What are the trends? What do we think is happening now? And then they got on a call with the other two groups, s o that they can compare and contrast here's, what's going on everywhere. Here's, what's idiosyncratic to this particular city. And then the, those that those groups reported out. And so you can get the whole organization engaged in a short period of time. And these, these kids, these young adults were out, you know, for a couple of hours. And and yet they came back with, lots and lots of information and felt more a part of the organization. Instead of just sitting at their desks, you can engage the millennials, you can engage, folks that you want to pull in and give them a sense of the whole organization, as well as the or ganization's e nvironment. So I think you can make this an ongoing practice across the organization.

Kate Ebner:

I think that's a really great example because in a way we're remembering that we can use our own powers of observation, right? We're not powerless to understand what's happening. We just have to begin to be really keen observers and look for data issues as you point out, and then do that work of bringing it all together and, you know, consolidating and synthesizing and drawing some conclusions from it. And I remember in reading a chapter that you wrote on sense-making that one thing that you said is that sometimes it's better to have a plausible working story than a perfect roadmap. And could you just say a little bit more about that?

Dr. Deborah Ancona:

Sure. Um, so we're trying to understand a hugely complex, fast moving environment. So the fact of the matter is that we are never going to get it right. We are never going to get it right. So striving to get it perfect can be a waste of time. What you want to do is get as much as you can get, or as much as you can learn in a short period of time, so that plausible working model of the world, and then iterate with it updated try some experiments. Is this right? Is this true? U m, we think that want X, test it out. Do they really want X? Is that what the bu y-in b uying pattern looks like or not? And if it does great, you continue on. And if it doesn't you say, okay, I was wrong about that. And let's go back to the drawing board. So you want to get your assumptions about the future out on the table, what, you know, consolidated in some way, and then recognize that even that is not going to be reality. It's your map of reality. And as such, the map can be updated it can be added to at the margin, or at some point you might find that it's so outdated that you have to start all over again. but the key is okay, let's be open to, what's changed. Let's go o ut, collect our data, let's pull it together and make our map experiment and test the map, improve it. And then when it's no good, throw it out and start all over again. That's the constancy of sense-making

Kate Ebner:

I, you know what I love about it, especially as you just described, even the option of throwing it out and starting all over again is how dynamic it is and how different it is than that. Um, we're sort of like static, strategic planning, thinking of the past, right. Where people have said, okay, you know, again, this is what we think is going to happen this year. Here's our strategic plan or our annual plan. Let's, let's go. And I think the idea of testing your assumptions, listening closely to what's happening and what people really care about what people really want and need, and then adapting continuously. I mean, that's a, it's a very dynamic pattern that you've described. Um, I'm thinking as, as you're talking about this, like kind of giving us permission to stop trying to do it perfectly and to start, kind of tuning in and testing, and I'm curious how would you recommend, especially for organizational leaders, you know, and when we think about like where to get data, like, what kinds of data might we be looking for? What are some sources that somebody might use to inform their sense making?

Dr. Deborah Ancona:

Sure. First of all, I would look to experts or their experts or their analysts in your industry. Are there people who've been really good at predicting the next technological innovation go to the experts and see what they've learned, i n a, in a practice that Henrik resume calls, vicarious learning, or that's a psychological term. You want to learn from others who, have, have done the work that you need done. so you, y ou can iterate and experiment. That's learning by trial and error, but trial and error is not the most efficient way to learn. It's one way, and you want to add to that vicarious learning. and so that means, ag a in, experts reaching out to customers, what our c ust omers want, what are they dissatisfied with? Why are they leaving you? Why are they going to competitors really get that? As the agility, people say the voice of the customer in there, that's, that's really, really useful. Um, w hat are other people in your industry doing? Um, a nd beyond your industry, a lot of times people learn, by b orrowing things from other industries, but t hat solve a particular problem that your industry might have. I was working recently with a pharma company and, they w e re very bureaucratic and their task was to, create a biotech within. And so their sense-maki ng was to lo ok at customers, but also to go and, see what their competitors were doing in that space. How did the y c hange? But then also looking at biotech companies, if they wanted to be biotech within, then that's look at what we're trying to emulate and pull in some of the features of what they have, changed a n d morphed given the context that they're in and they can't do everything that, that biotech might do, learning h o w other companies are sourcing for raw materials. Maybe there's something to be learned, from someone, again, outside of the industry, learning from within their own organization. What are people frustrated about? What is really, really not working, that they might be able to have some leverage, o n. So, I would think to go in all those different directions to learn, as much as you can from your larger ecosystem. And again, that's your, your customers, your competitors, your collaborators the, the experts in your field to say again, answer the question what's going on out there that we need to know about as we move ahead,

Kate Ebner:

You know, I think, I think Deborah you're, so it's so clear as you describe it, and it makes, you know, hearing you talk about sort of these practical things that we can do makes it seem very accessible, that we don't, again, if I go back to the way people were feeling last spring and summer, sort of, we can't see the future and we don't know how to plan. We don't know how to make sense out of what's happening in the world and what the implications are for all of us, for our industries, for our organizations, even for our families and our own way of working and way of living. And so it's really interesting to think about how this approach called sense-making can be applied. Okay,

Dr. Deborah Ancona:

I'm going to interrupt you. I apologize for a moment to say, yeah, it's not that difficult, but that said it often doesn't get done. And there are several reasons for that one, if you ask people what makes a great leader, s ense-making usually does not come up. People e nvisioning a nd execution and building trust. People do not talk about s ense-making now that has changed somewhat, from the pandemic. and I always ask th e question in my, c l asses with executives or, or work that I'm doing. Um, you know, what are the most important leadership capabilities? And it used to be that making sense of your external environment was tiny. Under 5% of people would Mark it. No w, it's, it's gone up in some cases up to 40% because people recognize that the cha nge, but it's not in people's mental model of leadership of what leaders need to do B ev e n if people know it's important, they say, Oh, I don't have the time. It's, it's such a big task. And we have many things to do to which I replied. We don't have time not to do sense making, because otherwise you're, you're going to put a lot of effort into things that are not valid anymore. Um, but nonetheless, you have to get over that reluctance that inertia, that wanting to stay in as opposed to going out. And that's another thing. People are very wary of. How do I go out? Well, why don't you just, I say, just get started call one person tomorrow that might give you information that's new and different, offers a different perspective, get your team, everybody on your team to make one phone call next week and see what that yields try a focus group with, with a community that, that you need to understand better now that the pandemic has, has wrought it's i t s f uture or it's h as, has rotted. So I don't know what the word is, but now that we are in a different place, just send some barometer out there to say, okay, how do we measure what's different? U m, and, and again, it could be very small things. I would like to underline that you can learn an awful lot in a short period of time. and so how do you mobilize? So first you have to believe that it's important. And second of all, you have to, j u st get started by mobilizing yourself and others in small ways so that people can see the value and then it'll take off from there.

Kate Ebner:

That's right. And it is ongoing, you know, you said in the beginning that there are three elements to sense-making being open to the external environment and what has changed. So I would also add for listeners notice what you're attached to because you know, those attachments may be not be well-placed right. So again, being open to that external environment, what has changed, collecting a lot of data, consolidating it and drawing some insights and conclusions from it, and then experimenting testing and adapting. So as, as we think about sense-making, I know our time is, is, is almost up Deborah. And I, I want to ask you one last question and then I would like you to just for a moment, tell people how they can find more of your work. So those are my, my two remaining things, but the first question is I'm struck by the, the way we often, as leadership coaches talk about sort of the CEO or the leader's job is storytelling. It's, it's being able to tell a story of the organization past, present, and future is being able to make meaning or make sense and describe that context to use your word to others. Um, so there's a, I'm curious if you would describe sense-making as the same thing as storytelling, or maybe an element of storytelling.

Dr. Deborah Ancona:

Yeah. So I think of storytelling usually as sense giving as opposed to sense making it part of how you pull data together is in a story. So in a sense, a story can be your consolidation of what you've learned and what's important what outturns you've found. Um, but, but since making itself includes those other things, you need to collect the data, open up your mind, test things out before you tell the story. so that the story that you're telling again is up to date and, and reflects where things are right now. So I think storytelling can be incorporated into s ense-making again, a s sense giving or as, as this consolidation of what you've learned, but if you're only storytelling, then you might not be updating your own story of, of what in fact is important for your organization.

Kate Ebner:

I think that that's a really great distinction. I'm so glad I asked you to explain that. Thank you for, for this Deborah and thank you for the very you know, important discussion that we've just had today. I know I've learned a lot from you and like many people, I'm sure they're wondering how they can learn even more. And I know that you've written many books, including X teams have adult teams that lead innovate and succeed that you have an organization called X lead that does consulting work and has many tools to offer leaders. I'm also wondering how you, how you would guide people to find you for collaboration or to learn from the work that you've done.

Dr. Deborah Ancona:

Um, yeah, so, it's, it's pretty easy. either going to the MIT Sloan faculty page to find some of the references of what my current work is. A lot that work is also included in X Lead, X L e ad is by the way, not a consulting company. We create tools and help others to do coaching and leadership assessment and learn about our, our individual leadership model, our X t e am or team model, a b out nimble organizations, which is new work on how the whole organization can move from bureaucracies to more nimble forms of organizing. Um, so references to that, fo r example, that latter part nimble, we just published a Harvard Business Review article on that that was published last year. Um, f ive leadership things you need to do in di gi tal change. We published an article on that on Sloan management review. So again, you can either just Google me or go to MIT Sloan, or go to X lead for, those references. th ere a lso at MIT Sloan and number of executive ed c ourses that I teach a new one is coming in may on nimble, l eadership. also have a tr a nsforming your leadership strategy, which is about our individual leadership model, which includes sens e-making, an d go to X lea d.co if you're interested in tools that can help you, dev e lop as leaders, indi v idually as a team or as an organization, becau s e we've been studying this work for a very long time. And part of the goal of X lead i s really to help people to access, the mo d els and ways of operating that that we' ve created. And we would love to share the knowledge fantastic. Well, today you've been sharing the knowledge and, we real l y appreciate hearing from you and learning from you. Thank you. Thank you very much, Deborah and cough. We l l, an d thank you very much because you've been you've been great, discussi o n partner as you've pick ed up on, on what I'm talking about and, and li nke d it to some of your own work and, and what your company is doing. So, it's good to see that, that w e ar e aligned in, in a lot of our thinking. So thank you very much. My pleasure. And thank you for joining us.

Narrator:

Leading the Emergence is sponsored by The Nebo Company. If you would like to talk to Nebo about how to support the leaders in your organization, please contact us at www.nebocompany.com. Thank you.